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91
In General / Heroes & Villains .net
« Last post by martin@ on August 04, 2010, 10:23:04 AM »
This site is currently under re-development, any comments or suggestions are welcome, please post at http://heroesandvillains.info or use the H&V Forum tab above.

Thank You

Mac/Martin
92
New Board / howdy partner or, charlie athersmith is god.
« Last post by martin@ on June 11, 2010, 01:42:23 PM »
Topping the list of my favourite people for the month of April is Derek Hadley of Swanley, who was good enough to give my book a plug in the last issue. The cheque would be in the post, but the postmen of Birmingham have been showing Bolshevik tendencies of late.

Derek wrote to H&V on my pet subject of Charlie Athersmith (anyone who says ‘Charlie Who?’ is banished to the directors box forthwith). I’m glad, Derek, that I’ve helped convince you of our speedy winger’s exalted status For those unfamiliar, he was the greatest footballer of all time. Our correspondent makes reference to one non-believer, so, Derek, next time you see your friend – who we shall now call Mr X – perhaps you’d like to point out the following to him:

Mr X, in an attempt to deny Athersmith’s genius, claimed that Charlie didn’t win that many England caps. This brings to mind an argument I had with someone a few years back on the subject of Garry Parker. My adversary suggested that Parker must be good because he’d been called into the England squad. I seem to recall mentioning Geoff Thomas a fair bit during that row. However, Mr X’s claim is, in fact, wholly false in that Charlie played in an enormous amount of internationals considering the era he starred in. Athersmith won 12 caps in total, but when one considers that only three internationals were played each season, and it was rare that a player was picked for all three in a year, he did bloody well.

One player who did fare better in this respect was G.O. Smith, who collected 20 caps between 1893 and 1901, including five consecutive ever present seasons. Smith primarily played at centre-forward and in one game scored four goals. That game was a 13-2 mauling of Ireland in 1899, yet on the whole Smith consistently failed to find the net, even when

the Three Lions were winning 5,6, even 9-nil. So why was he in the team? It seems he was the token amateur. Smith played his club football for Oxford University, Old Carthusians and the Corinthians. Incidentally, the FA was dominated by amateurs then, rather than run by them as is the case now.

The only other player to significantly top Charlie’s figure was the legendary Steve Bloomer. This Dudley-born forward won 23 caps with Derby and, later, Middlesbrough between 1895 and 1907. More on him shortly. Suffice to say that he was another great player long since, and criminally, forgotten by today’s know-nothing pundits. We’d gladly have his like in a Villa shirt today.

Mr X’s other claim was that Charlie was often dropped by England. This is completely wrong. Athersmith was dropped twice. The first time came in 1892 after he’d won his first cap. It would, however, be unfair to claim he was dropped, rather the player he understudied for came back into the side. His debut had come as he neared the end of his first full season with the Villa (perhaps Lee Hendrie can look forward to the same honour next year?). That season ended with Cup Final defeat at the hands of a highly talented West Brom side. Bet you’d never thought you’d read a sentence like that.

The thing that made the Baggies so good were their wingers, who would fling deadly accurate passes to one another as they made progress up the field. On the right flank for Albion was a man named Billy Bassett. He was in Charlie’s England shirt and had been, injuries permitting, since 1888. Now, the England selectors had a choice. Drop an outstanding player in favour of an up and coming genius, or stick with the tried and tested. They chose the latter.

Bassett played his last international in 1896. A year later, Charlie took over and didn’t lose the shirt until the 1900 game against Ireland when injury saw him pull out of the side, although he played against Wales and Scotland, his last games for his country. In 1900-01 Villa were crap, Charlie was forced to play outside left and both inside forward roles and subsequently lost his England place. He was then transferred to Blues and, well, would you pick a Small Heathen? So, in response to Mr X, Athersmith’s international record actually adds weight to the claim that he was indeed the greatest player of all time.

Charlie was, according to contemporary reports, outstanding in every international he played (and club game for that matter). But he was also horribly underused. This is because Steve Bloomer, for all his undoubted attributes, was not that good at bringing wingers into play. There was, thorough out the 1890’s, a fierce debate raging over who was the best inside-right in the world, Bloomer or the greatest Villa skipper of all time, John Devey. The Scottish selectors made no secret of the fact that they believed it was Devey and were in a state of permanent joy at never having to face our man in a Villa shirt.

Yet in truth, Devey should have played because his partnership with Athersmith was awesome in the extreme. They seemed almost telepathic in respect of each other’s movements and a glance at their record at club level should leave no one in any doubt as to their worth to England’s cause. But before we leave the days of Villa greatness behind, if Mr X or anyone else wishes to know more about the finest team ever to grace a football pitch, there’s a book called Pinnacle of the Perry Barr Pets which tells their tale. The author’s name escapes me, but for anorak-type detail it can’t be beaten. (Shameless Plugs Inc.)

There is a moral to this story and it has relevance to the Villa today. One of the things which made the Villa the greatest club side in the world all those years ago – and, to return to the international stage made Scotland a lot better than England back then – was the stunning partnerships forged on the field of play. Howard Spencer and Albert Evans were as good a full-back pair as one could hope to see. They knew instinctively where their half-backs where who, in turn, could pick out the inside forwards brilliantly. Meanwhile, along with Johnny Campbell at centre-forward, the wingers were utilised to the full by their fellow forwards and would rarely fail to deliver a pinpoint cross because they knew, instinctively again, where the support would be.

If you don’t want to travel back 100 years, look at Morley, Withe and Shaw, plus Evans and McNaught. Even more recently, Cowans could always find Daley who, poor crossing apart, had the happy knack of searching out David Platt’s late surges. And coming right up to date…er… well, you tell me. Alan Wright has an amazing ability to lay the ball back ten yards to Steve Staunton. Other than that the only sign that any of our players have the slightest idea what a team-mate is about to do comes from Lee Hendrie and Darren Byfield. Having played together in schoolboy representative sides and come through the ranks in tandem, they at least look like they are in tune with one another’s thoughts and deeds.

So, as John Gregory goes summer shopping, perhaps he might look at bringing in players who can complement and link up with those good enough to remain on our books. We have long moaned about the lack of productive forwards, but we have four top class ones on our books with another couple making decent enough strides through the reserves. Problem is, they don’t seem able to play together.

What I’m trying to say is, I’ll settle for Shaw and Withe, but if Gregory can unearth us an Athersmith and Devey, world domination here we come again.

Simon Page
93
Features / the holte & i
« Last post by martin@ on June 10, 2010, 01:11:44 PM »
[float=left][/float]I set out to create an authoritative and objective item about the Holte, it’s times and it’s part in the history of the club that has been the focus of so much of my emotion and cash over the years. I soon realised that, because of what it is to me and the experiences I’ve had on it’s terraces, I had set myself an impossible task. Anyway, what follows may not be objective but it is how I remember a few of the happenings which were important to me. (With acknowledgement to Simon Inglis for pinching his format if not his ideas.)

v Rotherham February 1968 (0-1)……. Seven times we’ve won it, no one else can catch us up!’

Tradition has it that football supporters are introduced to their fate by their fathers. Coming from a totally non-sporting family, my initiation onto the Holte was left to the persuasive wiles of a nine-year-old classmate. How he convinced his dad to take another unruly lad to see the Villa I’ll never know. But it is Graham Attwood I have to thank for the beginnings of an obsession.

It was on a murky but magical Saturday in winter that I took my place on ‘ the Holte. Left of goal, face peering through the low railings which passed as crowd control in those days, I strained to make sense of a fourth round FA cup tie viewed from boot level.

For me it was a delight to view five Villa players, but the real wonder was simply to see all those thousands of people in the same place at the same time. We spent a fair part of the second-half leaping on each other’s shoulders in a precarious effort to see the very back of the steep bank of faces behind us. I learned a lot that afternoon – the stoical acceptance of defeat, a few new words, and the fact that given the right angle, you could frame the whole Witton End in Johnny MacLeod’s bandy legs.

v Hull City September 1969 (3-2). “I want to be in that number…….. .

Two seasons on from my Holte End debut and I had graduated up the terracing. The front was for wimps and my group of eleven year old toughs congregated behind the white tunnel wall on the Trinity Road side of the Holte. The fact that we rarely won hardly mattered. Some Saturdays were special, and this was one of them.

Much of the second half was spent willing on the team as even the outpost we occupied was engulfed in the collective roaring of thousands of Holtenders. Between us we turned a two goal half-time deficit into a glorious single goal victory.

I came away nursing a sore throat, a drained nervous system and a stupid grin. But it didn’t matter. I’d done my bit, I was part of the Holte. I was absolutely hooked.

v Portsmouth January 1970 (3-5). ‘We’ll support you evermore………..

By now die Holte was mine. Actually, I grudgingly shared it with two friends. We re-affirmed our ownership on alternate Saturdays by arriving at one o’clock and queuing to get in (this for games attracting less than half the ground’s capacity). I could not understand why everyone didn’t do this, little knowing of the more adult pleasures of another Holte a hundred yards down Trinity Road.

Once through the turnstiles The Holte became our playground with the labyrinth of tunnels

under it’s steep slopes serving as secret passages in a host of war games.

In our mind the Holte was the best there could be. We simply ignored the crumbling terracing, sprouting weeds and ancient drainage system which spilled waste water from the pitch onto the feet of supporters. Like the team we followed, the Holte was falling apart.

v Blackburn March 1970 (1-1)…….. born is the King of Villa Park.’

Another excursion to the front (due to the presence of television cameras) and a rendezvous with fame. At the age of eleven I was the person responsible for a crucial Villa equaliser. In reality, for the first time ever, I knocked back the matchball to Bruce Rioch who, in his eagerness to get on with the corner, sprayed us all with that orange shale mud which still surrounds the pitch. A quick corner and George Curtis bundled home the ball. I’m told by those allowed to stay up to watch the match that my point saving heroics were only visible as a musty grey smudge through the goalnet. But who cared, the point I had won would herald the start of a relegation-avoiding revival to lead to next season’s championship. For good measure I vowed never to wash the Rioch mud from my face and clothes.

v Bournemouth February 1972 (2-1). ‘…Sing a song of victory, we will win Division Three”

Two seasons on, we had been relegated and I had washed again (football supporters are fickle like that). For me this game captures what the early seventies Holte was all about more than any other. By now the clubs’ support, focused on the Holte, was gaining recognition. The club and it’s support were one and the same. This was a game we would win simply because we wanted it that way. The match is now history; MacDougall’s headed goal setting off a passion, volume and intensity of support rarely equalled. Hugging strangers, people climbing floodlights, etc. But my mind’s eye focuses on a lanky youth scrambling from the Holte End masses to join the on-pitch celebrations. Crombie clad, booted and sporting an unfortunate seventies haircut, his absolute joy is probably more representative of what it was to be a Holte Ender then than any amount of thirtysomething reminiscences. Perhaps more significantly there were no dire threats of fines or officious notification of recordings taking place. He was simply shepherded back onto the terrace.
Division two days………. but Villa we love you’

We knew that the first division was our destiny, it was simply a question of waiting. Supporting the team from the Holte had become a ritual around which adolescent life was built. We were time-served members of the Holte and delighted at the growing numbers sharing the experience.

Matchday still meant early arrival but more to secure our spot three quarters up the terrace than anything else. War games had given way to a collection of carefully honed superstitions from the pre-match cheering of Terry Weir to his goal line pitch to the collective willing of the Trinity Road pigeons onto the field (if they landed in the centre circle a Villa win was assured) every fate was called to the Villa cause.

Relationships between club and supporters were healthy. A Wembley win and exciting league form had helped cement a mutually beneficial relationship. Within it all the Holte was a focus for the sometimes exaggerated emotions which supporters nurture, reflecting a new pride in the club’s resurgence and it’s young squad.

v Sunderland April 1975(2-0). “…We’re going right up to the top!”

Our second division Holte End days were to end before a buoyant full house in brilliant sunshine and with no pressure whatsoever. The Holte was a solid bank of support in celebratory mood, the final whistle heralding the on-pitch party which had threatened all afternoon as the Holte poured forward putting the wilderness years firmly into the past.

As the celebrations ended I walked back towards the Holte. Pausing on the eighteen yard line I looked upwards into the scene of so many triumphs and disappointments. From pitch level, in brilliant sunshine and devoid of ifs masses, it looked smaller than I imagined it should. I did not realise it at the time but that moment marked the end of an era for us also. We were sixteen and about to leave school. From now on our Holte End days would be set against the pressures of an adult world.

Division One. “A.V.F.C. Aston Villa are magic, are magic…….

Back in its rightful place and with more vocal opposition the Holte simply got better and better over the following seasons. Always original, it developed a repertoire of songs and behaviour that was pure spectacle. A few balloons brought to one early season game became a blizzard of colour that welcomed the team onto the pitch for the rest of the season. And the fervour was not confined to the young. Many was the middle-aged man seen shamelessly clutching handfuls of balloons at 2.50 on Saturday afternoon.

More athletic and absolutely unique was the ‘V’ for Villa routine where volunteers would be held upside down over the heads of the crowd, legs in a ‘V’ shape. This occurred at most games but on one glorious occasion some spirit of the Holte orchestrated scores of people to attempt it simultaneously. Legs in a ‘V’, scarves tied between ankles swaying throughout a rendering of ‘Walk On’. Goodness knows what a psychologist would make of it but at the time it was tremendous.

v Manchester City August 1977 (1-4).’The fence must go…’

Feelings between Holte and club still existed but with a little less trust than when we had been fighting our way back together. This game demonstrated the club’s view of the Holte. Without warning a fence was erected down the centre of the terrace. Certain Holte-enders reacted and more attention was focused on rocking the fence from it’s foundations than backing the team. The fence went but the sour taste remained.

The pain and glory of supporting Villa is well known. Villa teams possess an infuse capacity for self-destruction which explains the fatalistic attitude displayed by supporters. Of course this means that when things do turn out correctly the delight is so much more pronounced. This was never demonstrated better than in two games I days apart during our championship season.

v Ipswich Town April 1981 (1-2). ‘We’re going to win the lea……. !’

Billed as the championship decider, the queues stretching an hour before kick-off reflected the fact. So it was with smug season-ticket holders smile that I cut across the line to battle my way up the terrace. The Holte was absolutely packed and radiated a sharp-edged tension relieved slightly at kick-off, but turned to grim stoicism when McNaught bungled a backpass to allow Ipswich to score. Despite desperate backing and Herculean efforts from the team we lost the game. My despondency hurt almost physically. Seventy-one years and we had blown it. For once I just wanted to get away from the Holte.

v Middlesborough April 1981 (3-0). ‘Villa, Villa, top of the league’

A series of good results and the championship was back on again. Although we didn’t know it, the points which were to win the league were gained on this day. A goal by ex-Holtender Gary Shaw settled the nerves and then the rumours started – Ipswich had won/lost/conceded the title. Whatever, part way into the second half the anxiety was lost in a wave of pure noise. It was carnival time in B6 and the Holte was leading the band. The team picked up the mood and produced some of its purest football in years. Once again we were working together.

This game closed a significant chapter in Holte history. ill-conceived changes to the end and rank performances killed a little of the spirit. We now watched football from a high security corral.

v Coventry City May 1992 (2-0). “Son, you are a Villa fan, and that’s the way to stay’

An end of season game meaning little to most Villa supporters. For me, though, the -match was special. This was the match I had chosen to take my eldest son onto the Holte for the first time. We stood a few yards from where my Holte End days had begun twenty-three years earlier. Such a lot had happened on the terrace behind us that had shaped my life that I held a nagging fear he might reject the place. In the event a Cyrille Regis goal in @ seconds dispelled those doubts. This day represented one of those occasions any parent will recognise when a natural cycle was completed.

1993-94. ‘Big Fat Ron’s claret and blue army ……… .

I expected it all to end on a depressing note – a frustrating final season and the Holte going out with a whimper. Then came the Tranmere game and the old shared focus was back. A gutsy team willed on by the collective force of it’s supporters. But perhaps the most fitting Holte End epitaph came a hundred and more miles south of Villa Park at Wembley. The cup was won, the celebrations underway then, cutting clean through the bedlam and echoing round the stadium, the sound of thousands of voices:

‘Yippee yie aye,
Yippee yie yoh,
Holte Enders in the sky!’

The spirit lives on.

John Harris
94
Features / my hero: des bremner
« Last post by martin@ on June 10, 2010, 01:09:12 PM »
We have been blessed with many talented players at Villa Park who are remembered with great affection on the terraces. In all the time I have followed the claret and blue, however, only one player has seemed irreplaceable.

He wasn’t a prolific goal scorer a la Platt. He didn’t float balls half the length of the field with pinpoint accuracy like Cowans, but as a hard working ball winner, Des Bremner was second to none.

He began his career with the world famous Banks O’Dee “A” team and was to return to humble surroundings when he rejoined Ron Saunders at Small Heath. Not surprisingly then, when the world’s greatest manager paid £275,000 to Hibs for his services in September 1979 my first reaction was “Des Who?” There was no need to worry, though, as Bremner proved to be well worth every penny.

Saunders said that Des was the most under-rated player he’d ever bought and that summed up the Scotsman’s career. lgnored at international level (one appearance as substitute in 1976) and overshadowed by a forward line of Morley, Withe and Shaw in 80-82 when he was at his peak. His greatest moment came in the European Cup final when he shone against the cream of Europe. So many of Bayern’s moves were halted by a crunching tackle from Villa’s midfield dynamo, though once again the praise was focused on others.

He was an ever present in the 80-81 championship season and played in every one of Villa’s European Cup games as well as the World Club Championship and Super Cup ties. When he was made surplus to requirements by Graham Turner and made the short trip to the graveyard across the city we decided we didn’t want another ball winner and have paid the price ever since.

The only bad memory have of Bremner is of seeing him play out his career in a blue shirt. Despite this, I remember him with a fondness reserved for Villa greets simply because he always gave the 110% his manager and the fans expected of him. Perhaps that’s why he never got the credit he deserved. Des always did what was expected of him, nothing more and nothing less.

If only the current squad had his commitment and never say die attitude. If only they gave that all important 110%
95
Features / The purist’s football is now international football
« Last post by martin@ on June 10, 2010, 01:00:40 PM »
from john e

International football is what football used to be like.

The winners will be from a country who have an astute Manager, work well together as a team, and play to there collective strenghts.

Whereas the Prem will be decided on who has spent the most money, regardless of the various strenghs and weaknesses of the Managers, we all know who’s finishing in the top 4 next year.

Its down to Money.

If Chelsea or Man Utd fail one year they go out and spend £50M.

You can’t do that in the international game, you have to work with what you’ve got. Take Greece, winners of the Euro’s last time out, that’s the equivalent of Middlesboro winning the Premiership, no matter how good the manager it isn’t going to happen, because it’s a game of big bucks now.

But it can still happen on the International stage. Who’s going to win this year? It’s not clear cut, and its down to the managers and players to compete on a much more even playing field.

I’m enjoying Euro 2008, even though England aren’t there, its makes a pleasant change from the totally predictable glory hunting moneybags premiership.

Discuss this here:

http://www.heroesandvillains.info/discuss/viewtopic.php?t=25916&start=0

96
In General / Mirror Lies Exposed
« Last post by martin@ on June 10, 2010, 11:44:53 AM »
[float=left][/float]the mirror wrote: MARTIN O’NEILL 4/06/2008

In our edition of 9 May 2008 under the headline “Fair Kop” we stated that Rafa Benitez had exposed Martin O’Neill by contradicting claims he had made at an earlier press conference. It was not our intention to imply that Martin O’Neill had lied to the press and we are happy to set the record straight.

Tugboating hell. That’s exactly what you intended to do. At least have the decency to set the record completely straight by printing MON’s version as truth.
97
Day by Day / 20 Years Ago
« Last post by martin@ on May 27, 2010, 03:33:32 PM »
I'm backing Jo '90 (August 1990)

JOSEF VENGLOS wants to be known as a ''tracksuit manager'', but his first day in the job as Graham Taylor's successor with Aston Villa was not one for sweaty synthetic fibres. It was the Midlands' hottest since 1911, forcing the English First Division's first foreign manager into T-shirt and shorts as he supervised a work-out in the noonday sun.

Dr Venglos - a doctor of philosophy from Czechoslovakia - attracted a three-figure crowd of mad dogs and Englishmen to Villa's training retreat in rural Warwickshire. For fans and media men alike, it was a case of seeing is believing, and Venglos was easy to spot: a chunky, surprisingly mobile figure in black, conjuring operatic images with his exhortations to get into the ''penalty aria''.

The players looked a little bemused when Venglos shouted: ''Okay, next modification.'' Those who shot wide were ordered to do five press-ups, and Paul McGrath was soon on the deck. ''Vinning goal'' was easy to understand, however, and the squad appeared happy enough after changing into garish surfing gear which someone half-seriously suggested was Villa's new away kit.
David Platt admitted to some surprise at Venglos's appointment, but denied any apprehension. ''First impressions are that he's very much like the gaffer - Graham Taylor - bright, keen and very knowledgeable.''

Doug Ellis, one chairman we can believe when he says there is a Czech in the post, introduced the 53-year-old Venglos, by now perspiring profusely in a dark suit, to the press.

He was, Ellis claimed, ''the most experienced manager in the whole of Europe'', and his appointment would stand Villa in good stead for 1992 and the anticipated movement of players between European countries. Venglos modestly protested at being called ''Dr''; he preferred to be known as Jo. In excellent English - as well as coaching the Czechoslovak national team and Sporting Lisbon, he worked in Australia - he said he felt privileged to be working for such a famous club.

''I want to continue the family atmosphere created by Graham Taylor, and his friendly, hard-working attitude towards the game,'' he added. ''I respect the players - they are proof of Aston Villa's coaching policy. I'm not coming here to change their football, but I will try to add something.''

He has wisely kept on Taylor's assistant, John Ward. His knowledge will be particularly important in the games against Bohemians in Dublin on Tuesday and at Wembley next Friday against Arsenal.

Villa finished second last season and, as one questioner pointed out, the fans expect a lot. ''I think,'' Venglos replied with a mixture of charm and bluntness, ''they are correct.''

By PHIL SHAW - The Independant 04/08/90

More Memories Here
98
Day by Day / Chelsea 7-1 Aston Villa. 27th March 2010.
« Last post by Test Topic on May 24, 2010, 12:17:52 PM »
[float=left][/float]Read that again.

And then again.

And then remember that the Chelsea result is the worst in our history since 24th October 1964, when we lost 7-0 to Manchester United. Our record defeat is 8-1 v Blackburn. We’ve been beaten 7-0 five times; so this is our seventh biggest defeat in our entire history.

We’re a team supposedly pushing for the top 4. How can we be so outclassed by Chelsea? Before the game Martin O’Neill had said that previously, Villa used to go to Stamford Bridge hoping to keep the score down. We’d certainly been outplayed several times, but never so humiliated as today.

This is our first league defeat in 2010. Being “unbeaten” means absolutely nothing unless you’re winning plenty of your games; the statistic hides the important fact that we’ve only won 3 out of our last 13 games. Against Burnley, Wigan and Fulham.

This was no freak result. We’ve once again been playing poorly in March. You’ll be aware that Reading in the FA Cup was O’Neill’s first ever win in March whilst at the Villa. And who can forget the capitulation at 5-0 Liverpool in March 2009 or Man Utd 4 – 0 Villa in March 2008?

So once again, after sitting pretty at the mid-point of the season we screw monumentally. At the begging of March we had to be considered favourites for 4th. Games in hand and a relatively easy run in compared to our competition. Poor performances and draws against Stoke, Wolves and Sunderland put a stop to that. Now we’re 7 points off Spurs in fourth, and a massive 17 goals worse goal difference. Those 3 games in hand on Liverpool has gone and we’re still below them.

It’s worse than that. Everton, who had an extended summer holiday and showed up for pre-season training in November, are now only two points behind us. We won’t even mention Small Heath.

We’ve just suffered our worst defeat in 46 years. Imagine the motivational powers needed to pick the players up after that?

Well, having struggled past a succession of lower league sides we are only one game from an FA Cup Final. However we’re up against the same team who humiliated us today in the semi final. And this time, they might play Drogba.

Half our side are quite visibly dead on their feet and have been for weeks. If you don’t use your squad enough, you end up with half the squad knackered and the other half rusty having barely seen a match for months.

It is all very well giving Luke Young a run out now, but why against a team where we’re not going to be doing much attacking? I see Habib Beye came on, giving us three full backs on the pitch at one point.

Was Martin O’Neill trying to prove a point? I don’t know. It would certainly be a more palatable than simple tactical ineptitude.

Full backs, lack of strikers, favourite players, no substitutions. He’s never going to change. He’s just who he is. You either decide you’re happy with that, or you decide you’re not.

This is 4 years into Martin O’Neill’s reign. This is not a ramshackle team he’s inherited, this is his team. His £100 million team. There are £10m players that can’t get on the bench. Martin O’Neill has had the backing of a seemingly perfect chairman. The best conditions for any Villa manager in the last 50 years. So why is it once again going wrong?

Luke Moore scored the first goal against Chelsea, at Stamford Bridge in O’Leary’s last season. We lost 2-1. We played pretty well, committed and determined and were unlucky. That same season we went to Arsenal and lost 5-0. O’Neill is taking us into the same dark territory. Today’s result has that same finality about it, that sense that this manager can take us no further and his time is up and only an FA Cup win will reprieve Martin O’Neill’s reputation.

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